Jest Out of Jurisdiction
Law Enforcement / First Responder stories and experiences with a focus on comedic blunders, events, and the lighter side of stressful jobs. Stories are firsthand accounts told by the hosts Flash and T-Dot with accompanying guest interviews.
Jest Out of Jurisdiction
Pooches, Possums, and Poltergeist
From notorious incidents to cultural shifts in the '90s, we recount some of our most memorable experiences. Whether it's a traffic stop with a twist or the eerie tales of supernatural encounters, our stories paint a vivid picture of the quirks and challenges faced by law enforcement. We also touch on the lighter side, sharing humorous anecdotes about office antics, car accidents, and the unpredictable nature of police work, revealing the blend of humor and seriousness that defines our careers.
Blue lights from the dead of the night, lying low to run a dim street light Laughing through the written reports. Truth stranger than the wildest courts, tales from the force gone astray, caught up in the games they play. High speed chases gone awry. Serious turns into pie in the sky Just out of jurisdiction Left during the conviction. All right guys.
Speaker 2:We've got another episode for you here of Just Out of Jurisdiction. Got a pretty good episode, I think, lined up for you tonight it's going to be good.
Speaker 2:So I'm no stranger to having to sit across from a police chief or two, and tonight I'm actually sitting across from two of them. I've worked for four chiefs in my career. Two of them were not so fun to work for. Two of them were great to work for, so two of them are were not so fun to work for. Two of them were great to work for, so two of them were in this room. I'll let you all figure that out. Yeah, you ain't gonna say nothing.
Speaker 5:Who's what they know, who they are, so that's weird that we're able to do this podcast together. I feel the love over here, no, no, I'll say it you two are definitely.
Speaker 2:I enjoyed my job under you all.
Speaker 5:Well, that's because Derek hired you.
Speaker 2:Well yeah and that's the thing. So Derek is the chief that hired me.
Speaker 3:But you didn't work long under me.
Speaker 2:No, he got out of there. I hope I'm not the reason, that's all right. I I hope I'm not the reason. I was like oh, good Lord, look who they've hired.
Speaker 5:And if you're listening and I happen to be the one that take you to jail it's Derek's fault. Listen. So I'll tell this Derek. And this is what was so hard when Derek was my first sergeant right, he was my sergeant, so as he progressed up the ladder and I became sergeant, he's lieutenant. He's. You know what you did every position, every position.
Speaker 3:Well, I think it was. They told me I was the only chief that had served every position within the department.
Speaker 5:Yeah, that's right. I mean you were every he as I was staying put, yeah, but you know, but it as I was staying put, derek was, but you know it was hard because he's my sergeant, so there was times where I still felt like I didn't tell him exactly how I feel about this.
Speaker 3:Well, and he did. He let me know exactly what he thought, and that was a good thing. That was a good thing.
Speaker 5:Sometimes that was not the right thing to do.
Speaker 3:Sometimes other people didn't feel like he should be telling me. Some things that he told me.
Speaker 5:And I paid them. Listen. One of the funniest things I was sitting in Joe Smith's office. He was a detective slash IT guy. I'm sitting there, derek calls I had screwed up a report like a FOT. Yeah, just like the time. We know how important those FOT sheets are, so I had like written like 1800 or, and I should have wrote 1600, something like that and I was having a good day that day too, I don't know that.
Speaker 2:I ever saw you have a good day.
Speaker 5:I was a chief this is why he's lieutenant. And he was over the FOT and that was always kind of like this is why he's a lieutenant. He was over there. That was always kind of like ugh. So he comes, he's like hey. I was like, hey, I'm up here. He radioed and I called back in the back yeah, I said I'm in Joe's office, I'll be right there and I'll fix it. Okay, and Joe, it was not me, I swear. Joe says whatever. And then, sergeant, will you come back to my office right now? I was like. I was like I was like the position of attention back there.
Speaker 3:I don't even know if he remembers this, but but you got to admit I never raised my voice.
Speaker 5:But I learned I didn't rat Joe out, though I just took that ass to him, because I probably did look at Joe and was like, oh, I got it.
Speaker 3:Joe would never do anything like that.
Speaker 5:No, he would never ever poke or try to get somebody else in trouble? Not at all. I came back in there. I was like Joe, come on man, I just got ripped. Dude, I thought I was like gosh, thanks.
Speaker 5:Now Derek probably should have sent me home several times, but not for that one. But I mean, there was, I was like, yeah, I had t-dogs pretty easy going, but I I was opinionated and that that was not always the right thing, especially when you go from a patrol sergeant, you know when your world's here, and then when you move into the administration side, you kind of see like and I've apologized several times to him and Stuart, I wish I had apologized to him, darrell, all of them, I'm like man. The last time we was together I was like man, my bad guys.
Speaker 5:I was such a jerk to you guys.
Speaker 3:You honestly don't know and that's me too. I mean, as you go, as you're a patrolman sergeant, every time you reach a different level you're like you look at the guys that are in those positions before you and you're like boy, when I get in that spot, I'm not going to do it the way they're doing it now.
Speaker 5:And you get to that spot and you're like, well, maybe I can see kind of why they want to see it. You can see exactly why you have to. There's a controlling element that you are unaware of. Well, I'm chief, I can do it you don't realize the limitations there's politics involved.
Speaker 3:You become quite a politician. There's limitations on what you can do.
Speaker 5:There's budgets that you didn't understand, Like, oh my gosh, you've got to sit down and like, oh, all this money's got to line up right.
Speaker 3:When I get in there, I'm like, oh, we're going to all have brand new chargers every year.
Speaker 2:All the things you wanted. From the other side of it, it did keep me in a 2009 Crown Vic until 2018.
Speaker 5:Well, that might have been. Darrell finally put me in one. Finally, I was like golly man.
Speaker 2:Listen, I'll be honest with you and I wish I still had that. I would love to have had that convict over some of those chargers we had.
Speaker 5:They just oh yeah, they were the ones. So what year did you start policing?
Speaker 3:Started. Literally when I started, I turned 21, may 3, 1992, and I stepped into a cruiser for the first time on May 4, 1992. So it's a long time ago. Who was that? That was the sheriff's office. Yeah, laurel County Sheriff's Department. I actually started out, man. I worked with some of the legends that you've heard about when you were young. I started out. The first person I was in a cruiser with was Raymond Roark. Oh yeah, I worked with Bill George. Yeah, back then state police-wise, you had well, miller Groot was my chief deputy at the time. He went on to become a state trooper. You had gosh Alan Lewis. Yep, jack Riley was a young trooper back then.
Speaker 5:Did he have toothpick in his mouth back then too?
Speaker 3:Yeah, all the time he was born with it Same same. He came out of the womb toothpick in mouth. Yeah, you need to get Jack on there. He can't.
Speaker 3:KSP won't let him. Yeah, steve walker, uh, yeah, you know. Joe joe newton, uh, joe schinkenfelder, oh my god, those guys for the pd. You know, sam brock was a rookie back then. Uh, doug gregory, hump, hump was a. Hump was a was a patrolman. Humps again, humps on, he's coming, he's coming, he'll be a good one. Yeah, he was a patrolman back then. Hump's on, he's coming, he'll be a good one. Yeah, he was a patrol unit back then. Gosh, it's just Kenny Jones.
Speaker 2:Kenny Jones has been policing since God rested on the seventh day and Kenny started policing on the eighth. Yeah, I mean, those guys were road units back then.
Speaker 3:So I started, yeah, started roadies back then. You know. So I started, yeah, started 21 in the Laurel County Sheriff's Department. Back then you worked a half a day in court and then you spent a half day on the road. You know you rode with people for a while. When you actually got to hit the road you spent a half day in court and a half day on the road and then you know you had your the guys that were running the, the courts. You know even those guys. You remember their names uh, don wattenberger, you know, uh, elbert owens. Those guys would run a courtroom like, uh, marine corps di I know I don't know how many times later.
Speaker 5:You know don will come in there. If you all don't shut up, I'm going to lock you up myself. We'd be back there in the old annex where it used to be a district court. I mean laughing at something somebody did disturbing court and bust in there and be like I've told you all.
Speaker 3:I remember being in a murder trial. I was just working the courtroom. I wasn't even at that point working the courtroom. I wasn't even at that point working the courtroom. I was working the back hallway just making sure that no one was, you know not authorized to come in there with Edward Owens and we were back there.
Speaker 3:I remember Johnny Phelps was one of the detectives on this. It was a death row case, so we were sitting back in the back and it was cool for me you know, just a 21-year-old police officer to be around all these detectives that were Junior McKnight was one of the detectives.
Speaker 5:Yeah, Desi, you know I remember Junior coming in there.
Speaker 3:You know he was assigned to Desi at the time and they were like don't let anybody.
Speaker 4:that's not supposed to be back here, come through this door and this guy knocks on the door. Open it up.
Speaker 3:Here's just a mountain of a guy with his beard down to here and he looks like he just barely crawled out of a hollow someplace. Yeah, standing there, I said, can I help you? He's like yeah, I need to come in there. I'm like not you sir?
Speaker 5:No, no, Not you man.
Speaker 3:Well, this way, you know he looks like he's a big unit, but I'm thinking, no, I'm not supposed to put anybody back here. He said, yeah, I need to come back there. I'm like no, he's like, well, yeah, I'm supposed to. Sorry, I can't let you back. He turned sideways. You know he's a big unit. Looking straight at you when he turned sideways, he's about as broad as a. Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know he's as broad as he is tall.
Speaker 3:I'm like oh, this isn't going to end well for me. He's like can you call the Commonwealth attorney back? I called back. One of the assistants comes up and he goes oh, come on in, junior, come on in. He's like do you know who that is? I'm like I have no idea. I'm like who are you? Who are you? Just walk back through here, that guy came out of the harbor.
Speaker 3:He said that's Jim Herman. I'm like, oh, that's the legend, that's the legend, jim Herman man. But just hanging out with those guys was really cool.
Speaker 5:Like Lonzo, yeah, lonzo. Oh man, you hear these names, you know, and you're like, oh my gosh. But I remember Johnny Phelps is probably. You still hear about his interviewing skills. Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:His Phelps is probably you still hear about his interviewing skills. His interrogation skills Unbelievable.
Speaker 5:That's who you wanted in if you want to crack it.
Speaker 3:Look those guys, junior, johnny, I didn't work with those guys, but I was around those people Just to hear them sharing stories and stuff was amazing. Just to hear them sharing stories and stuff was amazing. But getting to work on the street with people like Raymond Roward, bill George, all your mentors, steve Walker, me and Steve Walker used to drink, that was all we did. I mean, it was just a blast back then. You hear of these names, these guys from the 80s and they're just let's go with 90s.
Speaker 3:Well, they started in the 80s, yeah they started in the 80s, some of them in the 70s, so you started in 92.
Speaker 5:How long did you do at the sheriff's office?
Speaker 3:I was with the sheriff's department 92, 93, and 94. 92, 93, and 94. Then left the SO 94 over a little incident that occurred, involving a traffic safety checkpoint with the LCDC as a booking officer for a bit. We'll talk about that in a little bit and I think it's really great to go to. And that was a really good experience for me because at that point it was one of those deals where it was good to get off the street for a little bit because you start feeling bulletproof At that point. I'm 5'6", 140 pounds. I look like I'm 16 years old. I spent the last half of my time in East Bernstadt at nighttime. I'd been in a fight or two.
Speaker 2:I would imagine that working with Derek out on the street was like working with Joey out on the street. Joey's all of 120 pounds five foot in the, and we would. We would let him answer a call by himself. We'd be like we kind of want to get into a tussle tonight. We'd just let him go out. We'd be close, but it'd be.
Speaker 3:You're my size and back then.
Speaker 2:They would try you.
Speaker 3:And back then you know the way it worked. There were two PD officers out all through the night, there was a trooper out until 2 am and that trooper went in and you were maybe the last deputy out at 4 am in the county and then from 4 until 7, if you had to call in the county they'd take turns calling a trooper out one time and calling a deputy out one time. So by the time I was 22, I'd arrested two people for murder. You get the experience, you learn to fight and you bleed a lot. I mean you know it was a great experience, but coming off the road, going into a detention center for a while a great experience. I think that also kind of helped me get my attitude in check.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:You know and you start realizing hey, everybody, you know, there's a lot of good.
Speaker 2:Sometimes good people make bad decisions.
Speaker 3:There's some good people. That's exactly right. There's a lot of good people that end up in the back of police cruisers Right, and you start to realize that the people that we would take and drop off, you know they've got lives too and you kind of get to see them as individuals.
Speaker 2:We talked about it with danny and I think that's why I didn't end up in so many fights is because I tried to treat everybody like they just made a mistake, like yeah I never got any fights. I never took anything personally and I never yeah well, when I when I came back.
Speaker 3:He only got in fights after after you and I will say this too, you know, working at the Sheriff's Department great for experience, very fun, loved working at the SO. Probably my favorite couple years was there at the SO. The hardest, most eye-opening part of my career was probably, you know, a lot of respect for those CEOs out there because those guys have a really tough job. Like I said, very rewarding for me to have gone in this been james or somebody, somebody would come on here.
Speaker 3:He would be good because those guys, those guys that that was the hardest of all the the 27 years that I spent law enforcement. That was the hardest year you can get him or sean or somebody yeah, the most rewarding time that was that year that's been inside and, like I said, probably made me a lot better officer. I think it would be rewarding for everybody to actually get to see that side of it.
Speaker 2:What little time did I sit in there. I mean I wasn't on the CO side but you know, doing what we was doing for L4 and just listening to that, sean would come in. He'd be like, hey, man, we're hiring, I'd man, we're hiring. I bet. Nah, I'm good, you saw. Well, it takes special person, it does. I was like I don't think I could do it. I said I was okay with bringing these people and dropping them off to you. I said, but after sitting listening to this woman squall for six hours, the last six hours, I don't think there was richie.
Speaker 3:Richie baxter and I worked together inside, you know, trooper, uh, worked inside together and I remember, you know we had multiple people in there that would go on to serve death sentences, that were awaiting trial or awaiting some type of judicial yeah Ending to their whatever was going on. But I remember Robert Carl Foley, robert Bob we got you know Bob Down on White Oak. Huh, yeah, bob had some medical conditions and at night when we were working, he was in the maximum security area and they would send Richie and I in because he would have to be out in the day room. They didn't want to send him out because he was such a security risk. So they would send Richie Baxter and I in with Bob and we would literally sit there and play cards with Bob Foley at night to monitor. It was getting to experience stuff like that.
Speaker 5:I guess they consider him like a serial killer. I guess he killed enough.
Speaker 3:I mean, he's killed multiple death sentences Was he the one with the gas stations, and all that. No, that was actually, when I was telling you about being there with Johnny and all of them, that was actually when I was telling you about being there with Johnny and all of them.
Speaker 5:That was big. I was in ninth grade, something like that.
Speaker 2:Because he killed a few people too, didn't he Several gas?
Speaker 3:station candidates.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I guess he was yeah, and that was the same.
Speaker 3:That was scary.
Speaker 5:That was scary. Living in I lived up in East Bernstead and it was just scary to go in a gas station at those times, like you know you're like, oh my gosh, what's going on. But that was because you know that was. The victims were family and friends of family. You know it was really sad.
Speaker 5:It was I mean, because back then you know it was you know Joneses and all these people that had these places. You just thought, man, it was scary. You just didn't want to go down to the Shell Station. You're, like that might be bad, ended up like Richie Reynolds in Cheeto dust all over your front.
Speaker 2:I believe you'd have had more Cheeto dust in that fight. I don't know, poo, I don't know, but that was some weird times and the Foley stuff have had more than cheeto dust in that fight.
Speaker 5:I don't know, poo, I don't know but it is. You know that was some weird times and the foley stuff you know my grandparents lived down there close to that, had family aunts and uncles on white oak and fawn ridge and those that you're like. I grew up that down, those places you're like, oh my gosh, so it's different, different. It's the 80s, that was the 80s and 90s right there. It was different times. Plus we had the other, the murder mount guys. We had like three active serial killers in London.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I forgot about that. That guy was a killer.
Speaker 3:And you start thinking maybe it's us, Maybe it's something. Listen, I've told people.
Speaker 2:I've told it in interviews with other agencies. I've told it in interviews with other agencies. I've told it to people. I was like, for some reason, this area is just a magnet for crap.
Speaker 3:We always say that if it's going to happen, it's going to happen in London.
Speaker 5:Yeah, the I-75 makes it a weird stuff.
Speaker 2:And you've got the parkway also. Yeah, it's a crossroad.
Speaker 5:You know it is weird when we went over to Wattsburg how many people knew the business of what's going on in London. It's a hub. It's very important to the east of what happens here in this part of Kentucky in London, because it was just such a people work over here. They'll drive all the way from Wattsburg, which is what? Two and a half hours, something like that Depends on how fast you're driving. To work at our hospital.
Speaker 2:We need to track down Hunsucker and try and get him on there too.
Speaker 5:Yeah, that'd be fun. I'd like to know some stuff going on over there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no joke.
Speaker 3:But after that, after I left the detention center, I came on to PD. We tested and made it to PD in 1995. 95. Spent the rest of the time there.
Speaker 5:I think I never had to run in with you. You did pull me over one time because my high beams wasn't working in this old Camaro I had. And I got stopped right there at the courthouse and you were like. I was like, did I bright light you? And you was like yeah. I said man, well, you know that's a violation to you. No, I'm just kidding, but that's the only time I ever got stopped by the city police. Maybe your brother.
Speaker 5:My brother had that one coming. I think he was a miscommunication, I think. He came and complained about that to Eddie Sizemore, a legend. He's like oh, but what happened was and I'll let you tell it because it's funny he had it coming. It was a joke. It was a joke, but now I think it got misconstrued about what I said. I'm sure I'm sure it did.
Speaker 3:It was funny, though this is a classic line and it should shouldn't be used by you don't, don't, don't, don't, don't do it anymore, but so I I had, I had a sense of humor while I was out on the street. I know it's hard to believe now, but it's great. I pulled over someone's brother and I think his girlfriend was with him, wasn't it? Yeah, for running a stop sign, and I was always a big. You know, I was a canine unit, I was an interdiction unit, so I always worked traffic quite a bit, never wrote. I don't think I probably wrote.
Speaker 3:If I wrote you a ticket, it's because you literally made me write you a ticket, because you got a ticket, one of two ways you were going to go to jail, yeah you needed it, yeah, or you made me so mad, you talked yourself into it and I couldn't figure out how to take you to jail, yeah. So he ran a stop sign and I pulled him over and said, hey, I'm just going to give you a warning because it's what I did interdiction. It's like, hey, you ran a stop sign back there 16, 17-year-old kid, whatever. Yeah, might have been 18.
Speaker 5:I don't know.
Speaker 3:You know, you ran stop sign back there and he seemed like a good kid. You know, easy going. Yeah, he said well, I slowed down. I said you know what? It reminds me of a joke. I once heard about a police officer pulling a guy over that ran a stop sign. He said, well, I slowed down down. I said police officer takes his flashlight out, starts hitting him in the head and tells him you want that?
Speaker 4:you tell me when you want me to slow down when you want me to stop. Yeah, classic, classic joke. Yeah, so I'm like I don't think you could get away with that these days.
Speaker 3:It was great it's great so, um, you know, I'm like, you know, hey, just just, you know, slow down. You know let's just slow down, stop. Don't just slow down, stop Stop. He said, okay, appreciate it. Next thing, I know it's like getting a phone call. I was like threatened to hit somebody in the head with a flashlight for running a stop sign. I'm like I don't think so that was funny Classic when Derek stopped me.
Speaker 5:I remember he had. He had the cool it had to be. You had a mustache back then the cool, cool 70s corn stache.
Speaker 3:No, no, it was like the 90s, 90s thin, ah, okay, thinner yeah, it was a cool dog, cool car.
Speaker 2:Yeah, around this good time the vice mustache, that's it. Yeah, that's it, that's it what else we got.
Speaker 5:I know there's some I want you to tell the. Was it at the sheriff's office when the you had to take care of the dog thing?
Speaker 3:Because this one, this was tragically funny.
Speaker 3:We had a murder that took place. I remember it was December, I think 1993. It was very cold out. I remember. He knows the dates. Yeah, yeah, I don't know why, because I can't remember what I ate for dinner last night, but I know it was December. It was great in there 1993. I remember because it was cold out, there was snow and ice on the ground. I remember because it was cold out, there was snow and ice on the ground and I just, you know back then, like it was when we worked third shift, there wasn't a whole lot to eat out. But I remember Hardee's was always open. You had Burger Boy and we would eat at Hardee's. I always ate at Hardee's back then and I was out by myself. Nobody else was out, trooper was someplace else. I'd stopped to eat at Hardee's and I just got out, started eating.
Speaker 3:Dispatch called. It was Greg Owens and I forgot who was working with him Mark Begley. Mark Begley and two great dispatchers, by the way. Great dispatchers, yeah, they were Mark. If you wanted two dispatchers to, by the way, great dispatchers, yeah, they were Mark. If you wanted two dispatchers to handle a bad call, that was two of you'd want. Back then Mark yelled at me, said you know, I thought it was SO9 at the time. He said SO9, got a domestic of some kind going on way up 490, like almost in towards Winding Blade. Two subjects arguing. They keep hanging up on the phone. So I'm like.
Speaker 1:I'm at.
Speaker 3:Hardy's on South Main Street. So I'm like okay, you know, I head that way, get up, get in my cruiser, start heading that way. Again, it's ice, it's late, it's early morning hours, so I start heading that way as fast as I can. But it's on eyes start going out that way here. Dispatch saying you know, so now just make you be advised. Subject keeps calling back, hanging up. Sounds like they're arguing pretty good, so I'm getting there as fast as I can. Still on way I get about to, I guess, 490 and 25. I hear them drop tones. Oh no for la unit. Maybe a little bit farther down.
Speaker 3:An LA unit come 10-8, super 9 ambulance run a possible gunshot wound? Oh no, and I give the address out. I keep waiting for them to say you know, is that the call? I'm going on? Still don't hear anything. Yeah, so I finally, after a while, I key up and say is that LA unit going to the presidents that I am going to? Is that subject that they're arguing with? Has he been shot? Remember, mark begley, as calm as he can be, saying well, so nine, can't really say for sure, but looks like it's pretty good bet he's calm, he was good.
Speaker 3:He looks like it's pretty good, bet he's calm he was good he was looks like it's pretty good bet, yeah, I love it that just little hint of sarcasm and looks like a pretty good bet.
Speaker 3:I love it so, uh, we get I head on out that way. And now y'all again, it's ice out there. Uh, what ends up had happened? Two gentlemen had gotten into from what we can tell had gotten into an argument and he keeps calling. Called Greg, first time, greg Owens, and said you know, hey, owens did a great job. Said you know, I'm fighting with my. You know we're having a fight here.
Speaker 3:You need to get the police out of here. You need to get them out of here now. Hangs up the phone. Greg calls him, backs up the phone. Greg calls him back. He answers the phone. Hello, hey, is everything all right? Everything's fine, don't worry about it. You don't have to send anybody out of here. Hangs up as soon as he hangs up, calls right back. You better get the police out of here. Up calls back. It's just non-stop the whole way.
Speaker 3:Last phone I mean there's literally nine, ten phone calls made with Greg calling him right back from. Everything's fine, don't send the police to. You, better get them out here. I'm getting ready. Well, the last call is you better get the police out here. I'm getting ready to shoot this guy. Hold on a second pow, I've shot this guy. You go ahead and send the police out here, but I but I'm not going to be here. When you get here, it hangs up.
Speaker 3:Greg calls him right back, hello, and Greg manages to keep him on the phone the entire time while I'm on my way out there. So when I get there and he actually talks him into going outside and he's outside. When I pull in, he's outside. He's got his hand up under his shirt like this, talking on the phone. I get out, draw down on him. Let me see your hands, let me see your hands, let me see your hands. Doesn't pay any attention to me. So all I see is this with the phone. So the next thing you hear is me hitting him as he goes to the ground Because he's not listening to me. I think he's got a gun, I don't know what. He's got up under his. I get him to the ground, handcuff him, bring him to the back of my car.
Speaker 3:By this time you see an LA unit coming or you can hear the LA unit. You can't see it Coming down the road. See it coming down the road. I go up, open the door. I said pitbull, look at me right there now as I open the door. I slam the door back. We just been given pepper spray, so open the door, pull the pepper spray, pepper spray. Shut the door back. Open the door.
Speaker 3:Brian ring since, coming out of the LA unit as they arrive, goes to the back and is walking towards us. As I open the door up, the pit bull runs through the door, past me, around the side of the house, comes back and pictures in on Brian. He just targets Brian, starts running right at Brian. Brian turns and runs the other way. Moose runs the other way, starts yelling, shoot him, shoot him, shoot him. I pull my weapon, fire one round, get the dog, open the door up again and there's the gentleman that had been shot in the head, our perpetrator, who's in the back of my car. When we finally get the whole story alleges that the gentleman that is dead, who's a relative of his, had molested the dog, and that's why he shot the oh my gosh, he shot the victim.
Speaker 2:So there's a law in Kentucky now about barnyard sodomy. So there's a law in Kentucky now about barnyard sodomy.
Speaker 3:The next night I'm in Corbin Because this is a whole mess. There was another trooper, barry Blair, and it's so I'm in Corbin, one of the troopers from another county. We meet there at the halfway point and he looks at me and goes so is it true? I said do what he said. Is it true? I said what he said you shot the rape victim.
Speaker 5:I didn't know it was Barry, it was.
Speaker 3:Barry. Barry was with me that night. It was hilarious.
Speaker 2:That's hilarious, that's amazing, it's true. That poor dog.
Speaker 3:Supposedly it's true Put it out of its misery. It was just wild down there, especially on the north side of town. I remember that was meth. You really hadn't seen a lot of meth until you started seeing it there at the end of 1993. I remember first fight with somebody. It was on meth.
Speaker 3:I'm not going to say I don't know if you guys would know these boys or not. There was a family that pulled one of them it. I don't know if you guys would know this. These boys are not. There was a family but pulled one of them over. Saw him get into his vehicle. I was pulling into Ape Yard Market. Saw this guy getting into his car. As he's getting into his car I hear the beer bottle fall out and start rolling across the parking lot. I'm like I've got to go check this one out. That's a clue. So I get after him. I finally get him pulled over in front of EB's shell, get out of the car. He's obliterated. I mean just obliterated. Ran him through field sobriety, no problem. Finally look at him and say Kurt, you know you want to go with me tonight. It's not the first time I've arrested this guy because you were dealing with a lot of the same people all the time.
Speaker 2:You get repeats quite a bit in this area.
Speaker 3:So I said, kurt, you know you're going to have to go with me tonight. And I reached down, had a hold of him, put the first cuff on him and when I did he turned as fast as anybody I've ever seen turn and he nailed me right between the eyes and I've heard people say they've been hit so hard they see stars.
Speaker 5:I don't know if I saw stars but, there was a million shiny things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, In the sky those were angels coming to get you, Gary. They were coming down swimming from high and let me tell you something, buddy.
Speaker 3:The fight was on, I swung. First thing I did out of reflex, was swing my flashlight and I nailed him and my flashlight went and it was gone and the fight was on. I mean he got me into a bear hug and I'm sitting there just doing your best. I mean it's a fight for survival, it's not. I mean I mean hit him with everything on my belt except a bullet, finally fought my way around the car. I mean literally fought from one my driver's side, all the way around until I got my nightstick and managed to break away, get my nightstick and literally just fought and beat him to the to the back of the car. Never got him handcuffed. Never got him handcuffed.
Speaker 3:Uh, finally got my door shut, literally laid down beside my, my cruiser and just trying to catch my breath. And he's he. Uh, he's still. He's still. I mean he's trying to tear. That's when we didn't have the plastic screens, we had the wire screens. He's sitting there tearing my screen out of my car, and the first thing he did, too, when we started fighting, was he reached down and he broke the antenna off my radio and so I couldn't call anybody, I couldn't get out to anybody. I got in my car finally caught my breath. Got in my car, started down towards London, got on my main radio, called and told me I had one while 10-15, coming in. Sam Brock came out and met me at the old where they used to sell trailers down there.
Speaker 5:Yeah, Huntleys, huntleys.
Speaker 3:Trailer he pulls in Sam constantly. Said man, he's coming Because Sam gets behind me. He said man, he's tearing through your screen.
Speaker 1:He's trying to get to you, but he's coming at you.
Speaker 3:And we finally get him into the celly port and literally, I mean it's just a fight from there on.
Speaker 2:It was wild, it's honestly wild, dealing with people that are on meth, because you wouldn't expect, because they'll be scrawny, they're emaciated but they're I mean so strong and they don't feel pain. Tasers don't work on them. I mean it's.
Speaker 5:You remember the guy that me and you went on it said the giant chicken would kill his, his or was in that house and was telling kill everybody. That guy, I don't know how. We talked to him in the car. He was flexed out. And this guy, I'm telling you dylan, this guy was six, five and eight and probably 400 pounds of just just muscle. I mean, he was the biggest dude. I was like we're going, this is going to be a bad night. And somehow I don't know if he was on PCP, I don't know what he was, but I tried to handcuff him behind his back and he would not move and I was like, why don't you sit down here? We'll go check that house. And I was like it's polymath, but I was like it's probably meth, but I was like, oh, I'll tell you, it took the whole squad. I think we had four out that night.
Speaker 2:Special K. It'll do that to you too. You all dealt with that guy, you and Patrick, the guy that y'all had a tase in the tub. Special K was his thing. When we get Jake on, I'll tell that story. It was our first adventure with that. You'll find out, especially when you're my size.
Speaker 3:It's a lot easier talking in jail than it is to beat me I don't know, but yeah, but there was a lot of fun times too, because we were talking about like Keith Schoolcraft and Greg Owens, who did an excellent job on that the murder that the dog was involved in. Yeah, the dog was involved in. Yeah, uh, I remember fourth of july you'd go 10 15 visit from from like june until halfway through august, you'd put they would be sitting there.
Speaker 3:It was when the the dispatch was in where the sheriff's department is now you'd pull down fourth street and they'd wait for you got 10 15, because that was just a chance for them at target practice, because they'd sit there and shoot bottle rockets at you as you come through. Oh yeah.
Speaker 5:That's crazy. Wasn't the city police there at first?
Speaker 3:Yeah, that was when the dispatch was in there. Yeah, that was when the dispatch and the PD were right there where the sheriff's department is now and the sheriff's office was in the courthouse.
Speaker 5:Courthouse, that's crazy, just seeing how Stuff's moved around. Yeah, was the post office. That's where the post office used to be. It's crazy, it's weird.
Speaker 2:And then you've got all the Dairy Queens that moved around. Yeah, that's funny. Their banks now.
Speaker 5:Pizza Hut. That was the place. I miss that stuff. I miss our old restaurants in London.
Speaker 2:I do too. I was talking about Chinatown the other day, chinatown. I miss Chinatown.
Speaker 3:But it was fun times. And then I came from the SO and then from the county detention center to the PD and I remember, of course, coming from that environment of working in the county to coming to the PD. It was like it's a culture shock, it's a little more structured.
Speaker 3:It's a little bit more. That was the first meeting with Chief Holland. I remember when I got hired, baker and I came in the same day together and we walked in. Baker went back, spoke to the chief first. They were back there for about 10, 15 minutes. Then the chief brought me in. He said you know, I'll never forget. The exact words Pretty much were hey, glad you're here, glad to have you, but let me tell you, if you police, like you did in the county here, you're not going to be here long. So that was it?
Speaker 5:I remember I was talking to the former mayor. I was talking to Troy the other day. He was like me and Lodge were riding together and he would have been on the council back then, I guess, when you first started. So Troy's riding with Lodge. Let's go check on Derek. I guess he was on a traffic stop. They kind of pulled over. He said some drunk was out. I guess he was doing field sobriety. This guy was hammered. He said Derek, this guy was so drunk he started leaning over top of Derek. Derek pushed him back, Tried to do some feels. But I can't wait. Troy said I sat there. We sat there and laughed. He's like should we go help him? Nah? Lodge was like nah, he's got that. He's like he's been placing forever. He knows what he's doing.
Speaker 2:Troy had a pretty good sense of humor when he was out on scene. There was a few. There's some things that I don't know that I'll tell some of the comments and things that he's made. You know what used to be.
Speaker 3:I remember the city council used to ride with us all the time. Oh, they knew too. I remember when I was in that pursuit where I got hit, a city councilman kept me from getting run over by my own car. Oh my gosh, yeah, he was riding with me during the whole pursuit.
Speaker 2:Is that when?
Speaker 3:you got ran over. Yeah, that's when I got hit by the car and I fell over.
Speaker 2:I think it's a great idea. Oh, it's good.
Speaker 5:They used to a lot. I remember that City officials to get out and kind of see what Because Troy was, you know he was, you know him and Bill Mays were my teachers up at North High and they would always, you know, we always called them like rescue rangers up there because they would have the radios and still listen to what was going on. They looked, we didn't know we were just dumb kids, but they were all about it. I was like man, they were in, but Bill was the chaplain and Troy was on the council.
Speaker 3:It's fun. I had a traffic stop one night and this was kind of a learning experience for me too, because early in my career at the PD and Troy and Major Young were together and I was outside my car with the person I had stopped. They pulled up and Major didn't get out of his car. Troy was still sitting in the passenger seat. They were like hey, come over here and tell me what you got. So I walked over and was trying to keep an eye on my suspect and trying to tell them what was going on yeah and while I was doing that he was gone, suspect was gone, and of course I'm back back then I'm.
Speaker 3:You know I'm pretty swift too, so I take off running. We ran all the way down to where the done by the cinema, where the woods are there by the cinema yeah yeah, and through the woods we go, and as I'm running, here comes the major and troy in their car just keeping pace with me where you doing bud, you need a ride.
Speaker 3:And I remember getting to the wood line and running through the woods after him and then, after it was over, I come back and looked down and said you know, hey, appreciate it, appreciate all the appreciation being out there with me. They're like. They're like this is a life lesson get in your car and chase them.
Speaker 5:Well, I learned just walk, walk, they'll lay down.
Speaker 5:Yeah, not that early. Oh yeah, you was going to chase, yeah. Yeah, troy caught me one time. I didn't know he was out and there was a fire over some of the apartment building or something was going on. He was, you know, mayor. He's going over there with the fire department to see what's going on at this place.
Speaker 5:Well, I came out tired. It was, one of them was double backing or something, you know where you work shift and then off and then right back, you know. So I was like man, I'm tired and I didn't shave. I was like, oh my gosh. So I had an electric razor in there shaving. He pulled up. He's like, hmm, I was like I don't know what to do right now. He's like, hey, you can finish up. I don't know what to do right now. He's like, hey, you can finish up. I don't want you to look. I was just like, oh my gosh, he's going to fire me. I think he just won. You know, just became mayor, maybe a year or two or something. I was like, oh my gosh, I'm done, I'm done. Derek comes along, he becomes. When did you promote to sergeant. I know there's probably more stories 1990.
Speaker 3:Late 1997, early 1998.
Speaker 5:I come on the scene around 2002. Get hired, derek and I. He's the sergeant on night shift. Derek doesn't talk to me, and it wasn't just me. He doesn't talk to any rookie. No. I don't know why. It wasn't that you've been, it was just style.
Speaker 3:It wasn't even that. I mean, you just Didn't know me If I didn't have anything to say to you.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I didn't take it personally, that was just the thing. Yeah, so I knew of.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I knew of Derek before I got to the PD, but I didn't know Derek real well.
Speaker 5:You didn't know him as a sergeant, Right no he was chief, that was it.
Speaker 2:And there was like a lot of times and they're like yeah, but he's not. He came off as he was always but, he was thinking about something.
Speaker 3:And Travis can tell you, I never raised my voice to anybody.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 3:I never raised my voice.
Speaker 2:Probably should have yeah.
Speaker 3:I probably should have. That was the way, like Eric Wilkerson could tell you I came in and I was never in a bad mood. I mean well, no, I could get in a bad mood. Yeah, I could get in a bad mood. That persimmon face yeah persimmon face.
Speaker 2:I've heard that many a time that was a Doug. He called that. That was a Doug.
Speaker 3:Walked in. Derek had that persimmon face on that was. I walked in one night with Eric Wilkerson and Eric was like you can hear. I mean, it was just one of those nights and we was walking in. We were laughing A couple of us on third shift and second was in in there and you know how second can be sometimes oh yeah.
Speaker 3:I looked at Eric and said you want to watch me clear the clear. The second shift out real quick. He said, sure, walked in. I just walked in and looked at him and then walked on back into the sergeant's office. I knew it.
Speaker 2:I knew he was screwed with his. Well, hey, you weren't third shift.
Speaker 5:You wasn't nothing shift. No, you wasn't nothing. Yeah, that was part of it we had, and we'll get into that in a second.
Speaker 2:I mean, we keep saying it over and over again that shift's where it's at.
Speaker 3:But no, because I spent a lot of time on second shift. Yeah, you did.
Speaker 5:But there was third shift, and then there's London PD, and then there was third shift.
Speaker 2:And we got accused of that.
Speaker 5:We got accused of that. That was a bad day Having a clique. Yeah, we got broke up, we got broke up, but anyway, so Derek's not talked to me much. You know we go on calls together of course and stuff, but I hadn't been on my own maybe a month, month and we get a.
Speaker 3:We get a marker out in the county we was assisting um sheriff's office and we, we were tight, we were, we were really tight with, uh, the guys that worked third shift. It wasn't just the pd, it was. We were tight with ksp, we were tight with, so we were we would, I mean we would.
Speaker 5:We were tight. You know, we were extremely tight, don, and you know tommy eddie oh my gosh dz at the time yeah even you know, it was just it was just one big, big happy family up there.
Speaker 5:We we had a lot of fun. We'd eat together Not all the time, but we'd try to some. We're going out to this murder. We were getting broke into really hard in change like car washes or pop machines or stuff like that. Like car washes or pop machines or stuff like that. And I was up at the robo checking checking the uh, the coin machines. Well, they give that murder out. I don't know. I've been on them, I've been by myself a month. I'm like I don't know what to do right now. You know, just standing sitting there I see him and I and tommy johnson jumps in the car with him because he was out.
Speaker 3:Tommy was off that night.
Speaker 5:He'd been up at dispatch but just like any night owl, you can't sleep. Go up there. What's going on, whatever? So he's heading. They're heading up to the scene or going somewhere.
Speaker 3:Eddie had called and we were going to back Eddie up. We still had units in the city and it was me, tommy, tommy's from the SO, mikey and I told TDOT to head that way and me and Tommy were heading up in my car to back them up Because they had. As I understand, there was a couple people heading to the hospital.
Speaker 5:I think John Wathead was out heading to eddie too was john yeah I'm pretty sure there were several.
Speaker 3:I was heading up there because they didn't know where the suspect was and we had a couple people that were heading to the hospital. Uh, but it was a. It was a bad situation and halfway up there we were up on north 25. We had a call. Eddie yells at me a size precess, I mean, says you know, 807. I think that maybe one of the two suspects that are heading up the hospital are more the people that are victims that are heading up to, that may be a suspect. Can you signal to up there and go up there and check to see what the situation is?
Speaker 5:I I'm still locked in at Robo.
Speaker 2:Hey, I've been there.
Speaker 3:So I said 10-4,. You know I'll. I said let me, I've got a 10-12. I think 11-44 is with me. I told Travis I said pull over, I was already over, Let Tommy in with you.
Speaker 5:I met you up at George Humphleets.
Speaker 3:So let Tommy in with you. I'll meet you up at george humphrey humphreys. So let tommy in with you and I'll go back and head up to the hospital and see what's going on there, meet the ambulances with another unit, so tommy gets in with him. I start heading back to the hospital. I'll let you take it from there. So I didn't clear my seat.
Speaker 5:I have one of those. You know those cool things. You put all your paperwork, you know your pastor's yeah, those cabbies. So Tommy's sitting in the dash. I'm like here we go. He said we got to turn down 30 to head over that way. I was like, okay, or Pittsburgh Road or Richmond Road. I'm like, okay, I'd know this road. I've driven that. I lived on School Street, east Bernstadt. I used to go pick Ward Stokes up and drive that way to the high school every day, every day. So I was like, okay, I know this road, I know the S curve here is coming.
Speaker 5:I hit my brakes and it was about 6 in the morning, it was summer. I hit that brake and we just went faster. I was like whoop, and I hit like two trees. I know I hit two trees. You hit a bunch of trees. I hit a bunch of trees. We wrecked for about 52 minutes. It felt like I was like I don't know what to do. I'm looking over, he's looking at me. I'm like, and we boom, pow and I'm in the airbag, I'm burned up here, airbag burns and I'm burned up here, airbag burns and I'm like, yeah, this is like. What is this?
Speaker 1:I look over at Tommy. He's like we got to get out of here.
Speaker 5:I'm like, okay, he gets out, tommy gets out, and finally I mean he has to wedge out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because he's already wedged in there.
Speaker 5:anyway, it was horrible I'm looking over. I was like uh-oh, tommy's getting married in like two weeks. No, it's not, it was not that weekend yeah, it was. And he, he caught his glass. He had glasses on and we hit that airbag. Whatever hit it cut him both eyes, like for lady. He was like he's bleeding. I was like, oh, I'm like I get on the radio, I don't even know we've wrecked, we.
Speaker 2:46 I don't even know how help me, help me tom cruise.
Speaker 5:I still don't even know how to talk on the radio. Really good, I'm like where you at. This is the first time we ever had a conversation too well I'll get to that. So we got passerbys because it's almost work time and here comes people.
Speaker 5:I'm like Derek, where you at? This is the first time we ever had a conversation too. Well, I'll get to that. So we got passerbys because it's almost work time and here comes people and they're like Tommy's, like, how bad is it? I said you're okay, you might want to sit down. He's like no, what are you doing? So these passerbys come out. You guys okay. We're like, oh my god, she looks over. They look over like, oh my gosh, buddy, you need to sit down. What is going on?
Speaker 3:well, derrick's there here's what I'm going. I'm heading up the hospital. I hear travis, I'm 46 down, I have 46, I have 46 times. Yeah, I was turning around coming back to him and I come through there and I have.
Speaker 5:I didn't know what 46 down was until that day.
Speaker 3:He learned quick. So I come back to him and he comes up to me. This is the first words I'm fired. Yeah, I'm fired.
Speaker 1:I remember I'm fired. I'm like no, you're fine, You're fine.
Speaker 5:That's the first thing Derek gets to say to me.
Speaker 3:They make these cars every day. As long as you're okay, that's all that matters. They make these cars every day and Tommy comes walking around and Tommy and I are close friends I mean, we were close friends back in the day like as close as you can be yeah, as far as buddies go, I know who he's marrying. Yeah, you, I know who he's marrying at this point. We've been out on social events with him and the woman he's married to and Tommy walks up and all I see is blood all the way down his face. Tommy walks up to me and goes how bad is it?
Speaker 3:I'm like, oh, it's not bad. I get off my car, like why don't you just sit down? And Tommy turns around and throws up, throws up so he rides an ambulance and I get him to sit back down. We get an ambulance to him, so we go up to the hospital. Now picture this Victim, suspect Police officer, police officer, and we're sitting there All in the beds. Every bed in the ER field was somebody and I'm sitting there going. You know well, this is going to be okay.
Speaker 5:Hey, that's the first time I met, really talked to the lodge, first time I'd ever met, and really talked to Gene Holland, the sheriff. I was like, you're okay, I'm yeah, sheriff. I was like so I'm coming here, you okay, I'm fired.
Speaker 3:I'm fired, I'm on probation, I'm fine, I've done a lot of bad things already anyway, so I kept telling Travis it's going to be okay, we have to end up being the person that actually did commit the offense in there so we got them under in custody, yeah we did, we got the suspect, the victim, two police officers. I got a new car. What I remember more than anything is the woman that tommy was going to marry at the time. She stood all about five feet tall and I remember her heels clicking down.
Speaker 3:I didn't tell you down the er kim kim yeah, clicking, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click. You have to go in and check on tommy. She comes straight to me, she puts her finger in my face. She said I'll have you know if he scarred up and kept me in this way. I'm coming after you, yeah I could see I was scared, then I was like oh my gosh, fire me please.
Speaker 5:She's gonna kill me, she, I, she. She came up to the hospital later than everybody you know, because she put on the full, she got dressed for this.
Speaker 3:I was like, oh my gosh, she was mad though she came out to me and she, she told me, she said if he cannot be in this wedding, I'm coming after you. And I'm like Kim, I didn't do anything, I wasn't even the one driving.
Speaker 2:That guy.
Speaker 5:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:I got lucky. I never wrecked you ain't pleased until you wrecked.
Speaker 5:How many wrecks have you been in? Oh my gosh, somebody told me to ask you about a wreck or something, maybe on a song, I don't know what it was.
Speaker 3:The worst thing. Oh yeah, greg Ables, it may have been Greg, yeah yeah yeah, it wasn't bad, but you know it's bad when you wreck with the preacher. The preacher's going to be a guest.
Speaker 3:I've already got it set. When the chaplain for the police department is with you and you we were. It was just, we were just patrolling. We were going around, uh, the old dairy dart, and as we go around I've got my spotlight on, you know, making sure nobody's doing my job, making sure nobody's broken into anything, and, as you know, the big concrete barrier that's in the very edge on the southern side.
Speaker 3:I was going around I'm like I think that window's been broken out. I was like greg, is that? Is that window broken out? He's like I don't know back up and we'll see. So I backed up grace and looking, I don't think it is, I think everything's okay. I was like, oh, okay, so I just drop it into drive, start pulling forward, take the entire left side of my cruiser from the quarter panel back, just peel it back. And then we just stuck there. I mean it hit hard and I'm like oh, and it's the awfulest sound in the world. I'm like greg goes. How bad is it? I said I don't know, get out and check. Greg gets out, runs around the side. I said how bad is it? He goes looks pretty bad. I said did we? Did we do any damage to it? He said what the concrete?
Speaker 5:he said no, there's no damage I think stewart said ask you about another wreck or something I don't know. You must have wrecked everywhere.
Speaker 3:No, I didn't wreck everywhere, but when I did, they're memorable. It was usually without cause and really pretty good. I know the pursuit. I had a pursuit with George Hacker, a city councilman with me, started down by the Shell Station. That used to be the Shell Station, it's Texas Roadhouse now. We started doing it with it and I remember George saying, oh, as soon as we pulled behind the guy, he's like oh, we're in pursuit. And sure enough, pursuit across to what is it? Parker Road, where the hospital is now it's an open field into that field. Oh my gosh, sitting there doing donuts in the field and finally hit head on with my cruiser. Well, I jumped out. I'm thinking okay, we're, you know it's over. It's over, yeah.
Speaker 3:So I go running down the passenger side because I could see in the car I know there's two passengers and we all drive in a passenger. I get right to the passenger side and I realize something His car is not done because he starts backing up as I'm running beside. But at that point I'm committed. You know, okay, you're in, I'm beside, but at that point I'm committed. You know, I'm all in at that point. So he's there and he starts to go at an angle. So I start going at an angle because I figure, you know, like I said, I'm committed, and he just spins the car so like this way, yeah, and right at the driver's door, where the driver door in the front quarter panel hits, just past ads about where I hit my gosh.
Speaker 3:So I go flying over that side, so what they tell me, I don't remember a lot of it, but I go flying over that side in this field and land and when I do land I remember landing and looking up and I am at the driver's side, front headlight, yeah, and as I look up and see the headlight, I'm like it's not a good place to be and the car starts going away from me. I mean, it starts going backwards again. So I'm like, well, that's, you know, that's a good thing, it's not coming for me. But then, as I turn to my cruisers are coming at me.
Speaker 5:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:Seems I forgot to put it in park. Luckily, George Haggard, the councilman, is driving my car around me.
Speaker 3:Oh, my gosh, he literally drives my car around me, which is I. Come back up. My driver's door is right. At that point I'm like I'm still in pursuit. I jump back up, get in my car, pursue the vehicle on down in the field. That's hilarious, that's awesome. Jump out. He parked it. I don't know if it hit something or if he had just got out and stuck off running. I put it in park this time. Jump out, run, grab the passenger out of the passenger compartment, place the handcuffs on the passenger and I turn to run after the driver because I threw her back towards George. And that's when I found out something Adrenaline is a magnificent drug. Yes, when it goes away out something, adrenaline is a magnificent drug. Yes, because that's when I found out that I broke my left leg about four inches above my ankle. Oh gosh, because and it didn't hurt, um, it just it wouldn't hold my weight anymore and I remember falling, you know I couldn't figure out why I couldn't get back up.
Speaker 3:And then I remember Eddie Sizemore coming over top of me and yelling officer down and I looked up at Eddie and I was like who's hurt? His exact words were you. Are you stupid, son of a bitch?
Speaker 2:that's awesome oh my gosh so yeah, yeah, I don't know if you ever got wind of this. It was, uh, it was back when the 19th hole was hopping. That place was a thorn in our side and I I think you just gave roby abc I think'd done that was doing those details with the walkthroughs and everything. So me and one of the other officers he's still working, so I won't name him, but we was doing our little secret squirrel thing. You all were calling them out to us and we was catching them there at stop sign before they could get out on the road and running DUIs and stuff. Well, I backed in there and I thought I was being all sneaky and this is probably the worst.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you'd even call it a wreck that I had, but it was during the winter. So I backed in that back parking lot behind the speedy mark and they're right before conley road and, uh, I was in that crown vic. Well, it was running, so it's still heating up. Well, I had backed over the biggest freaking pothole I've ever seen in my life and they called one out and I was like, all right, I've got this one, this is going to be a good one. And I got to throw it and drive, and it goes.
Speaker 3:If you wasn't wrecking one, you wasn't trying, you wasn't working. The biggest thing for me is letting the guys, the Travis Hurley wreck.
Speaker 5:Was you there? He went over to. That's Jordan, I think.
Speaker 2:Jordan's the one that backed into the culvert.
Speaker 5:Or was it Travis Hurley wrecking over there off Maple? Those apartments over there by London Elementary Went off the thing. It was a fight going on. He comes around the corner and he puts it off oh, he puts it over the wall. He put it out of the wall, oh god.
Speaker 2:Somebody's like that's a kool-aid, like, oh yeah I tell you I'll tell you another story I'd like to see a video of. Is him putting that car fire out? Who?
Speaker 5:Travis, I don't know you hadn't heard that one.
Speaker 2:So they had a car fire. It was on the interstate or something and I'd only heard it secondhand. So I said he got his fire extinguisher out of the trunk and ran over there and tripped and it was just rolling.
Speaker 5:He's got some good ones. Me and Derek worked a lot of night shift together. Now we got to I don't know where he got this term, but he was the charm. You were the talent. The night shift, yeah, we were the talent which we got in some. I mean, we handled business, we did.
Speaker 3:That was the good part and I think that and I tried to I went up through the ranks and let the guys, as much as you could let you know, run the shifts. You know I'm my job is to make sure you got, especially when I made chiefs. My job is to let you guys handle your shifts and make sure you had what you had when I was on the street and sergeant. I really liked being a sergeant. I think that that was probably my well senior patrolman and sergeant were probably the two best jobs.
Speaker 2:I would say senior patrolman is probably. It's pretty solid.
Speaker 3:I'll say that that's the best position to have a senior patrolman. Just the money wasn't as good as not as good. No, we're near, but uh. Yeah, that was uh. But when we would get out and it on third shift, we thought we were, we were pretty special. I have to say. We got into some, some issues that it literally for a time period there it got to where I would just pull in the back lot, go ahead and get out and and start a use of force form. I wouldn't even fill in the blanks, I just knew it was going to happen, because I mean it was just a nonstop fight in some places.
Speaker 5:And it wasn't like we was. It was just happening and we were ready to regulate. We really kept London.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, we had an 80% drop.
Speaker 2:Yeah, our crime rate went way down and if you've got a proactive squad, proactive that is trying to get into stuff and trying to be proactive and prevent crime, and think you're gonna get into.
Speaker 5:Oh yeah, derek, derek's big thing. You know we wore them campaign hats out, you know, when we got on the call, so we get out of there.
Speaker 3:You think that would be something minor, but literally yeah, they knew when we pulled in boom.
Speaker 5:We were there, we were, we handle business, what?
Speaker 5:so we get out one time economy in something and I'm not no, it wasn't your fault we there's a bad domestic going on, yeah, and we go to the front desk, we're trying to figure out what room and try to get a key we figured out, because we hear screaming and carrying on and whatever, and people are like to help these people, help this woman or whatever. So these doors are real little and when they're, you know, we had, we had really good reasons to be in there. We, we had an emergency to get in there. I shouldered this door or whatever, and my campaign hat flew straight up like a Barney Five flicking. It was straight sitting on the back of my head. Now that door came open, it buzzed.
Speaker 5:I didn't expect it to it kind of hit the bill in my hat and I'm like hmm, and I've got one hand on my gun with my hat sticking straight up, fighting your way through the cockroaches with the oven.
Speaker 5:But I've got one hand on the gun, I've got it pulled out. I've got my campaign hat on back. I've got it pushing the door back open. Derek comes behind me. We sent Eric Wilkerson around back and he's still mad at me about this. The windows are like four inches, so we go in and I'm like where's?
Speaker 1:he at where's he?
Speaker 5:at. You know she's laying in the bed with the covers over him. There's only one place. You know she's not under the bed with the covers over her head. There's only one place.
Speaker 2:She's not under the cover she's not under the bed or he's not under the bed. Yeah, he's got to be in the bathroom.
Speaker 5:He's got to be in the bathroom, right. So Derek goes to the bathroom and he's like get out of here, come on, he has rabbit, he's ready to run. I'm like I'm still standing by the door, I've still got a gun out. I'm like, so Derek's like, stop, come here. I pull back to pull pepper spray out. He's going less lethal. I've still got a gun on. We don't know, he walks. He walks at me and I caught this guy.
Speaker 3:He did.
Speaker 5:I'm still trying to get my pepper sprout travis just the perfect open hand never all the other time has ever used was in the academy on those dummies and then weber coming around and smacking you just to make your eyes only time, the only time I've ever seen it used and it was just perfect.
Speaker 3:And this guy just ragdolls. I mean, he just goes to the ground, I mean open-handed, just and he timber boom.
Speaker 5:I was like, oh, I look at that, I'm like I killed him. I said, what do they call them the?
Speaker 3:only words out of my mouth was. You just made me look like a bitch. I'm like what.
Speaker 5:I mean this guy he's down there having like he's like season looking. I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm going to prison again. No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1:I mean.
Speaker 5:I caught him. It was the right move at the right time. He was coming either at me or get my gun, or he's going to run. I just caught him. Slick, he's down, he's like you knocked me the F out.
Speaker 5:He's like you've knocked me out, you've knocked me the F out. I was like Derek's like, cuff him. I was like, oh yeah, did we need an ambulance? No, he's alright, it's like all right. Did we need an ambulance? No, he's all right, let's go Get him to jail. But that was just one of the. That's funny. I mean, that's just the way it was. We couldn't help it, it was just we handled business.
Speaker 3:And that's why, when we'd walk in and we'd have somebody that'd square up, I'd look at them and say you know, listen, I'm the charm, they're the talent.
Speaker 5:You'd much rather deal with the charm than the talent. Yep, he was, because we'd be sitting there like pit bulls, ready to go and all he had to do was say sick them and it was on. It was fun. We also had some other moments that I don't know where you're at and where you want to talk about, but we had some spirits one time yeah, more than once. We have to talk about that.
Speaker 2:We've referenced that too many times and not mentioned that.
Speaker 5:Well, I always say once I had you on here, we'd talk about it.
Speaker 3:But I'm not a person that, but now we've seen more than one thing.
Speaker 5:We want to protect these properties, so we won't ever say where and who. We want to protect these properties, so we won't ever say where and who. However, there was this place that was notorious to have you know, and the property owners or the business owners would tell us like we've had.
Speaker 3:There's some stuff going on here and I was never I've never been one that's been like, oh, you know, superstitious yeah.
Speaker 5:I'm, on the other hand, a chicken, because we'd listen to Coast to Coast all the time and that would make you a little bit more.
Speaker 3:The only time that I've ever I've heard you guys, I've listened to you all show and I've heard you all talk about 2 and Up and yeah, we, the only time we ever we were ever really the demon.
Speaker 5:I still don't like that. You know, I tried to find that on the old they got like a podcast. You can go back and listen to old stuff. I'm like I'm not listening. I don't even want to find that.
Speaker 3:There was one night and we would drive around because you don't have nothing to do and you can get tired of listening to the same music over and over. So we'd listen to that stuff and we'd be like, oh, did you hear that? Did you hear that one? Yeah, we'd joke around about now that one night that they did play supposedly we played like an exorcism that they were doing- it was always on Halloween when they did it, oh yeah so that night I was like hey T-Dot, you know you listen yeah.
Speaker 3:I'm like that ain't right man. No, he's like no, I was like the usual. He's like yeah, yeah, so we do dive at Walmart under the lights Somewhere well populated.
Speaker 5:Yeah, deck had two. You know his places were like the Rita Lot, you know, by Weaver's or Walmart, if we scared or just meet in the back lot or something. But this one time there was this notorious place that we all knew, gaylor, josh Gaylor. All of us kind of were worried about this place and we were told some stories about it. It was what it was, we knew it. And you didn't go up there by yourself. Gary gets up. He's like you made me go up there by myself. I was like I'm not going by. If you beat me up there and you want to go by yourself, go, but I'll stay down here at the bottom of the hill or whatever. So we check it and we two up and talk about it.
Speaker 3:The thing with it is, and did you know if they know what the it's, the lights was the biggest part I've not talked about it so that particular night we checked the alarm went off all the time, and so Derek and I checked it, we clear it, we're getting ready to leave, but as we're going around it, as we're going around checking it, the lights would go off like the outside lights, but it's not like motion activated, because it wouldn't be where you were. It would be on the opposite side, it wouldn't be, and I wasn't going to, we stayed together.
Speaker 5:Yeah, we wouldn't. There was no way I was going to leave the side. Watched too much Scooby-Doo to do that. The talent was not leaving the charm on this one. So we get back in the cruisers and, for whatever reason I don't know if it's you or me I was like I don't know about this place.
Speaker 3:You've got to see the way we were parked, though, because I'm pointed down the hill, like heading down to the main roadway, and I'm opposite, and the opposite. He like hanging down to the main roadway and I'm opposite and the opposite.
Speaker 5:He's pointed back up the hill towards a back Like a garage or carpet.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's away from the building, and it was you, because we were sitting there talking. I don't know why I would say this we were sitting there talking about you know all the times we've been there and how you know the cleaning people say this I've never seen that, I've never heard that. But all the lights, how the lights. When you go around the building, it's like the lights follow you, but they're either in front of you or behind you. They're never where they're going off or they should be going off.
Speaker 5:And.
Speaker 3:T-Dot makes this famous sound.
Speaker 5:I say if you're out there, if you're here, if you're real, show yourself. I still can't hardly say it without getting scared. Different thing lights.
Speaker 3:Every light in the place Comes on, Comes on, Boom. Well, too bad. I say it as soon as he. I mean no, not a second later.
Speaker 1:As soon as he said it, I get chills just thinking about it.
Speaker 3:Every light in the place comes on, and when it does, I drop my car into drive and shoot straight down the hill. I'm stuck.
Speaker 5:I mean I'm stuck on top of the hill that is gone. When I see his taillights he's like a railroad tracksuit. He's gone.
Speaker 3:He is out of there. Yeah, I was gone.
Speaker 5:I came off that hill. I came off that hill sideways, but what you didn't see, because you left so fast is they also started blinking yeah no, I saw it.
Speaker 3:I saw the thing for blinking. They were blinking before I got down off the hill.
Speaker 5:I don't know why I didn't hit my dash cams on that one.
Speaker 3:I just hope it didn't follow you home. No, I saw it. They came on and they started blinking, not like on and off In different places.
Speaker 5:They all came on and then they started going around it.
Speaker 3:And I was gone.
Speaker 5:I was.
Speaker 3:Hand to the Bible, yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm out on that one that one.
Speaker 5:We saw the other stuff. Some know some other cool places. That the smoke, the smoke. You know the Closed up chimney. Yeah, Smoke would be bellowing out of it like it was burning firewood in there.
Speaker 2:And it was cemented in.
Speaker 5:Yeah, Told by the owners, you know the people that worked there. I don't know, and it was you know, just crazy stuff.
Speaker 2:It had this glass that place, wasn't there rumor that it was like an? Old. Civil War hospital or something.
Speaker 5:There's rumor, but I know that they had this double-paned. It looked like his face, this weird-looking thing. You know, when you see smoke and you see this face, you're like, oh there it is, but it was there in the daytime too. It's just your imagination.
Speaker 3:And you see, I guess the moisture in the air at night kind of collects to it.
Speaker 5:But I know, one time I was going up to the back I had a ramp I was checking because the alarms would go off a lot. I reached out to turn that door handle, to check it and it clicked in front of me. I was like we're safe, it's good.
Speaker 3:I'm out, I was like I've I've seen the smoke, the lights were would definitely I mean yeah that that that place didn't scare me as bad as the lights yeah, the lights were definitely they.
Speaker 5:It was definitely something that.
Speaker 2:So the cleaning crew there said they heard voices all the time they wouldn't clean past eight o'clock.
Speaker 5:They would like they would come in when they were closing up shop and they were out there by six o'clock, by dark. Wow so, and we would. We were good cops. We'd go up there and check that alarm. We were crazy. It was fun. Though then one time we got into it looking for it. So we go up to a place I won't, we'll cut that out. We go up to a place We'll cut that out. We go up to a notorious place and we're sitting there under a front porch and daggone. If a thousand pigeons didn't fly out on us and scare me to death, I was like, oh, I'm going to run out of here. I don't think that's the most dangerous thing.
Speaker 5:Oh my gosh. It was the funniest thing, though we were so silly.
Speaker 3:You guys were on third shift. I mean you know how you just. I mean, it just seemed like the strangest things happened on third shift.
Speaker 3:It was, I mean it would just find you or it would be completely dead. I mean, I remember, like third shift, what did you all do when you were on third shift and it was boring, or it was snowy, snowy do when you're on third shift and it was boring or it's snowy, snowy. So I watch movies probably. Yeah, go out to the pd. Yeah, just go see it somewhere and let yeah see. That's what I remember. Um, this was back when it was me. Eddie tommy, daryl zanet. Uh, our crew would be gosh. It could have been anybody. Uh, probably john whitehead goob. Gary alan harris, travis t dog. You Probably. John Whitehead Goob. Gary Alan Harris, travis T-Dog. Travis Hurley, maybe T-Dog.
Speaker 3:Early Eric when it snowed, we'd go down to the SO and play Rook Play.
Speaker 2:Rook. We didn't have the luxury, we didn't really have that relationship that you all had until later with the sheriff's department and all that.
Speaker 3:now sometimes we would go up to dispatch and play rook I remember, uh, john wright, uh, coming in one day on second shift and they must have got caught in dispatch playing. I know they got caught, yeah, dispatch, dispatch plane. And this is when, like I said, I was a sergeant, john Wright was a lieutenant, and I remember walking in and John and Major Young being in the back as soon as I walked in you know the rule at the PD, don't lie. And I walked in the back and Major Young said as soon as I walked in, I mean, didn't even get past the door, hadn't even shut behind me. Major Young hit. Said as soon as I walked in, I mean, didn't even get past the door, hadn't even shut behind me. Major young hit me as soon as I walked in. And you ever played rook and dispatch.
Speaker 2:So yes, sir, and it caught him off guard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, usually you were good as long as you didn't. So well, don't do it anymore. So, yes, yes, sir, john Rotten never looked up, because my last part was John.
Speaker 5:Rotten. John was good, john kicked me. I was like John, you're going to see something in this video in about three minutes, if you don't care, just to turn that off. Okay, I turn that off. Okay, take care of me, bob.
Speaker 3:you took my new job was sitting there, boy next, as I got that question, I know he's just sitting there waiting. Where were you? I could see it, man, we had a ball.
Speaker 5:we had so much good times. The dragging, yeah. So you know we've not really discussed it a whole lot. No, we've mentioned it. So I'll tell rookies somehow end up dragging some dead carcass.
Speaker 3:I don't know where it became a tradition but it did, it was there when I was a rookie.
Speaker 5:And disclaimer here. All these animals were deceased. Yeah, nobody, ever, nobody ever went out and killed something, but I know that they were looking for something for a while for me to drag. Before I got shipped this first shift on my training, I was with an officer. So they find one and throw that thing underneath my cruiser and I come out and say I'm like, golly, what in the world is stinking? Oh, somebody hit something somewhere, goob, or somebody jumps in with me. He's like let's drive up here. I'm like, okay, well, I need to drive by my house, right, quick. Well, we need to go over here. I'm like, okay, well, I need to drive by my house, right quick, well, we need to go over here. I was like, well, okay, so we drive down the streets, we need to go to Walmart, somebody's up there.
Speaker 5:I drive through Walmart, people started pointing. I was like, what is going on? What is going on? And why is that other officer following me? What is going on here? Because you know I'm like so, ha-ha, travis, t-dots drugs, you know big whoop-de-hoo. So we go, and you know I had to dispose of it. So we throw it out somewhere and get rid of it the next day, though, within a week, the next day.
Speaker 2:Oh, was it you that ended up getting the letter.
Speaker 5:Well, I don't know where it came from. Some people say it's PETA. I don't know. It was just somebody complained.
Speaker 3:Somebody at Walmart, I'm sure.
Speaker 5:Yeah, that's what I heard. So they called in and complained of you know, wanting to know if we killed the poor possum. And if we killed the poor possum, Is that how we, you know it was a tradition Is that what we have to do with our lives. Yeah, there was people that. So I was the last person to drag anything. It was the end of the tradition. That was my bad. Sorry, I hate that, but it was funny. Oh yeah, there was people that got in trouble and talked bad too.
Speaker 3:But it was what it was. I take the blame for that Because Major Young had this. They knew like if they let me go home and sleep for about two hours, three hours, then they could call me and I'd be. So I mean, I used to change my long distance phone company. My wife used to get so upset because I'd change the long distance. Don't get me like three times, huh yeah. So yeah, that was that was partly my fault because I'd owned up to it, woke you up.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that was a, that was here they called us uh, and I remember because I woke up real quick when I got there. There's a video.
Speaker 5:Yeah, so they bring me in. You know, matri Young brings me in and he was like, you know, when I was applying he kind of brought you in. He's like here's what you need to do and here's what we believe in, here's our philosophy. He's kind of the like you didn't talk to Lodge on that stuff. He's kind of prepped you for Kind of your onboarding, yeah. So he's like he was notorious for drawing.
Speaker 5:You knew how bad you were in trouble just by the way you drew he did like do of I don't know, just squares and circles, and I was told that about him, this guy's got a masterpiece going on over there, a Picasso. If you will, I was like I am going home today. I don't know how many times I thought I was fired. I was like, hey, whatever.
Speaker 2:It turns out, it's pretty hard to get fired.
Speaker 5:So I'm like man, I've had it. So how did that make you feel when them guys did that to you, made you drag that possum? I was like sir, I don't understand what you mean. He's a Marine and I'm a Marine, but he's an officer, he's a major. I'm like sir, I'm at position of attention and he's like no, sit down, he's due. I mean he's drawn. I'm like what are you asking? How did that make you feel, patrolman, when you were dragging that possum? I was like, well, it made me feel like I finally arrived, that I'm part of the team. Now, what Are you serious? Now come to find out. I'm sure Jim has drugged or tied mini-apossum or raccoon to somebody's, you know. But you know it was a big, you know there was a complaint, so he's had to do his due diligence.
Speaker 5:It was funny, though I was like I feel like I'm part of the team now, sir, are you serious? I was like, yes, sir, I did I mean that was? Like a rite of passage. Oh yeah, I'm going to tell you something.
Speaker 3:We, literally, you know, I felt bad because, like I said, they called me and was like did somebody let her drag last night? I was like yeah, they were like wow, were you there? I was like no, I was on a domestic, I didn't get to see it. Oh no, I was on a domestic, I didn't get to see it.
Speaker 3:Oh, there's a video. Oh, is there not supposed to be? Uh, no, no, it ended up whoops. It ended up me and uh, me and the two other officers that were, uh, on duty that night with the other. We went to them like, listen, you can suspend us, you know, send us home, just don't take this guy's traps away luckily they didn't they.
Speaker 5:He was my. He was my training officer for the night. Because I would have been there if I hadn't been on a team man, me and Derek got in the craziest call and I know we're going to have Josh on soon, so I don't want to, but, man, I don't know if we should tell it or wait for Josh, because it is one of the crazy blind date.
Speaker 3:Oh gosh, yeah, let Josh. We'll save that for Josh, let Josh.
Speaker 5:That was one of the funniest moments, but that was one of the. It came in. It was, like you know, after there was pepper sprayed.
Speaker 3:You know get them out of here now. I didn't even get that out.
Speaker 5:I was like, yeah, he's like I'm joking in here. What has happened? Oh, that was a wild night, but I'll tell that one with Josh. So it was. It was classic.
Speaker 3:What else you got Probably should we talk about, should we tell the actual story about when they did separate us, when we did get divorced?
Speaker 5:We were to divorce. It wasn't our choosing One night.
Speaker 2:The talent could no longer be with the charm.
Speaker 3:The charm lost all of his charm man. I'll tell you that.
Speaker 5:Me and Eric Wilkerson were working that night. It was just the three of us that night, just three of us and the major comes in.
Speaker 3:You knew that something was up because you know we would come in early. I mean, we were ate up with it even at that time. We'd come in early and hang out with second shift for a little bit, and, you know, hang out, and there was usually usually there was four of us on and so on. Yeah, so we'd come in and hang out and then hit the street.
Speaker 5:Yeah, we were either giving second shift a hard time. Yeah, out of good nature We'd wait until the first shift get there and tell them how bad they were.
Speaker 3:We had nicknames for the shifts the biscuit bitches. That was first. They were. Well they did. They went and got everybody's biscuits for them. All the command staff went and had their biscuits and a cup of ice.
Speaker 5:They were bitches we called them that, and we did it good naturedly.
Speaker 3:I mean, we called them that. I think they finally must have got to the. Yeah, I think they finally had enough of being called that. So we come 10-8. We're out there hanging out with second shift and all of a sudden we hear 8-0-2 come 10-8. And I'm like what? That's odd. That guy never goes 10-8. That's odd. I wonder what he's coming out for. You know what? 8-0-2 is coming out to hang out with us guys.
Speaker 5:This is good. He wants to see what? Yeah, he wants to. You won't see the action.
Speaker 3:You won't see part of this. So he comes in. We're all sitting there, hey mate Hangs out with us for a little bit and he comes in and finally everybody's starting to get ready to hit the street. He walks up and goes, looks at me and says I need to see you in my office.
Speaker 3:I'm like hmm, you know, this is positive, this is probably a positive thing. Yeah, this is positive, this is probably a positive thing. So we go to his office, sit down. He goes, never forget. I want to know what you think I'm like you. No, you don't.
Speaker 2:That's a very dangerous question.
Speaker 3:He said I want to know what you think I said about what he said just in general. What you think I'm like. No, sir, you do not want to know what you think I said about what he said, just in general. What you think I'm like. No, sir, you do not want to know what I think? No, he's like yeah, go ahead. He said I want to know what you think. So for 15 minutes I told him what I thought. And for four hours. He told me how wrong I was.
Speaker 5:I got scared. Me and Eric would call each other Back in the next two days. I'd be like is Derek out yet? Nope, no radio traffic. We probably were like 807-U10-4 or whatever Crickets man. So we'd go sneaking up there Looking down the hallway or something, go to the Pop machine, go up to dispatch that. That office door still shut for four hours and 15 minutes and me and ariza. What's going on? You know we two up what is wrong and then, well, then it comes out.
Speaker 3:You talked about the major drawings. There was two that I could kind of break the code, yeah, and the two that I kind of broke was he would make the four-dimensional boxes.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, if you made the four-dimensional boxes, you were okay. You probably messed up. See, that's what he was doing with the dragon, yeah, but now he had this four-dimensional starburst that he would draw. If you drew that one, you were weak. Yeah, he knew what you did and he knew you were weak. Yeah, he knew what you did and he knew how you did it. Yeah, and there was a situation going to happen. Yeah, what if he starts?
Speaker 5:drawing mazes or something.
Speaker 3:But when he started making those four-dimensional starbursts and he started filling them in was bad. It was bad. Well, this was the four-dimensional starburst with the boxes, the shaded being shaded in. So I sat there for four hours, 15 minutes or so and, uh, never forget his last words while he was, because I was just sitting there watching. I'm sitting there for four hours watching him, listening to him and watching him fill in these box, these starbursts. So at that I'm like you know we could have a problem.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:His last words were you and your guys think you're special. I'm going to prove you wrong. And he did. He did. You went to first or second? No, I went to second, I was senior road sergeant I went to second shift with like Tuesday sergeant I went to second shift with Tuesday, wednesday off. I became a biscuit bitch.
Speaker 2:The worst RDO.
Speaker 5:I became a biscuit bitch. I think Eric, out of everybody, because you have extra guys on too.
Speaker 3:I think Eric was the only one that stayed on third shift. I think ultimately it was good. I that stayed on the third shift. So, yeah, I think ultimately it was good.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I needed to go to the third shift.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we were probably getting a little bit out of control. I mean, we were probably getting full of ourselves.
Speaker 2:I mean, but at the same time I mean, you know, the results were incredible.
Speaker 5:What did?
Speaker 2:you hurt other than the biscuit bitches' feelings.
Speaker 5:Apparently we hurt the major and Lodges and everybody else.
Speaker 3:But you know it was good, because at that point I'd been on second and thirds for probably 18 years. Oh yeah, it was probably time for a change, yeah second and third shift was probably about 18 years total, but he did kill it.
Speaker 5:He promoted all the way up and was chief for what? Five years, Mm-hmm, he took it and ran with it. The man. We had a good time, so it was fun.
Speaker 3:It was a good time. We had some fun.
Speaker 5:Yeah, it was a good time. We had some fun. I wish you could have worked with him as the sergeant. I didn't too.
Speaker 2:I know you're young and it's just different, and that's what I said I was giving him a hard time at first, but working under Derek as chief was enjoyable. I mean, I didn't know what in the hell I was doing. But I enjoyed doing it, you know.
Speaker 3:Well, the big thing was, as long as you guys were doing your job and that was the way it kind of was on third shift, your job, and second shift, especially, as long as you know the guys, I would answer probably more calls than most of our officers would on the daily and that was the whole thing.
Speaker 2:If you could meet me at the radio, yeah, and I still remember the dude's last name was Burns and you've probably arrested him a million times, but the very first guy I ever arrested was Derek, on a call with me. It was over at Wildwood or something, I think. But yeah, and that warrant that he got arrested for, he never did go back and get it done. It followed me. I've done so many case reviews over that warrant. I finally got to get rid of it, but I still remember that we were notorious.
Speaker 5:We were at that time for that short window I'm not talking, it was a couple years. It was when we had that chip and we were doing what we was doing, but that was. We was talking about the flip-flop fight. When I was going up there that guy was like I know you and Derek House came to. That was just what it was. And now here I am fighting him again. It was just the time Meth was crazy.
Speaker 3:That's when the pills, the oxys, were hitting it was just a different time, even when I was a rookie. I remember my first when the cup was coming out. You remember the things that's kind of funny and enjoyable. That's what I told my wife. I told a lot of people. I think I've been hit in the head once too often because I don't remember really any of the awful stuff that people seem to remember. I remember the comical stuff that has a little bit of tragedy to it. I remember Kenny Jones, kr. I love KR to death.
Speaker 3:I was a patrolman coming out and going to one of my first domestics, you know, and I remember we get there on Tobacco Road, one of those little shotgun shacks that are on the side of the road on Tobacco Road, going me, kenny, and another officer who was a sergeant too they were both sergeants and walking in the front door. The guy going she's in here here, she's in here was walking through and literally turning left into a bedroom and as soon as we turned left in the bedroom, here's the lady is on her bed. You know, almost as close as you and I are together uh, not, maybe three or four feet away and she levels a shotgun. Oh, me, kenny, the other officer and the guy that's, and I remember of course you don't even have time to get your gun out. So me and Kenny just immediately hit her.
Speaker 3:I mean we just attacked her on her bed, oh my gosh. And we looked back as we're tackling her. I remember looking back as we're going down and Kenny was cussing I'm figuring he's cussing her. Well, no, it was. The other officer had ran out of the house on us as we were going down. I remember cuffing her and getting her cuffed and getting the shotgun pulled away from her, getting her out. I remember Kenny just immediately going get her and I got her her and he takes off man we gotta get kate I mean, you know that's the.
Speaker 3:I mean, you know it's, it's funny. Now, at the time, of course it wasn't as funny, but now you know, you look back and it's like that's, that's the stuff I remember. I remember the more comical side of it, and maybe somebody else thinks that's not funny at all, but for me that's just no, that's pretty funny.
Speaker 2:Because that's something you don't often see, Because we were all. I mean.
Speaker 5:My mom listens to these. Sorry Mom for some of this, but she's like if I would have known this was happening, I would have never let you win. How about? Mom, I was 26 years old. I don't care, I'm still your mom, exactly, yeah.
Speaker 3:Well, mom and dad, they would listen to scanners all the time. Stephanie and I, of course, I met being a police officer, her working through the court systems. She knew some of the stuff that went on. But when I went home and I'll admit, even as chief, when I went home, and you know, I'll admit, you know, even as chief, when I went home, my radio went off because it would literally drive me nuts every time I heard. And that was when I got out, when I, when I left the police department, uh, the weight. You know you always worry about the guys that are still there because they're your friends and you love these people. But I remember the entire time I was assistant chief and chief, it didn't matter where I was. Every time I heard a siren, you know, sound off, I was like I wonder what's happening, I wonder if everybody's okay, and I think that's happening, I wonder if everybody's okay, right, and I think that's the whole time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you don't miss the stress of it, but you do miss.
Speaker 3:You worry, you worry about your brothers, you worry about your sisters, yeah, and it's. I mean until you and you don't really even I never realized that I even had that pressure. I mean, in the nine years I was on either deputy chief or chief, um, I took two full weeks of vacation, yeah, in nine weeks, two full weeks away in nine. In how? Long nine years that's yeah now I would take a day here, yeah, two days there, what becomes weird?
Speaker 5:I remember and it was just so happened like the big Fourth of July thing here, the red, white and boom thing. That was like July 1, when I became chief and I'd already had scheduled vacation and already paid for it. So I was like this may be that one I get. So my first week as chief I was vacation. Yeah, it was weird. I was like and you could, you could get away for but you start getting phone calls immediately.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you could. You could get away for three or four days here, uh, two or three days there, but as far as a full five days to two weeks during a nine-year period. And yeah, it's time a lot of weight of the world, and then you could never ask. Like you know one of the things that I always did uh, you know, I always wore uniform. Um, I always wore my vest even though I was inside, because I expected my guys to wear one and I couldn't.
Speaker 2:Dang campaign hat and you would think you know that doesn't go unnoticed either coming from our side of it. Is that you know? I've got a lot more respect for somebody who's going to tell me to do something and then I see them doing the same thing rather than somebody that's going to tell me this is how it's going to be, but then you come in in ball shorts and you know whatever.
Speaker 3:Well, that was the. You know, that was it's a very smart move.
Speaker 5:It really is. It's a good leadership move and people need to know that. Don't ask your people to do something that you won't do Right.
Speaker 3:Right, and it did. I'll be the first to tell you it did stink Sitting behind a dance wearing a.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, I was pretty fast in my Class A uniform.
Speaker 5:There's nothing comfortable about a Class A he brings me in. I was working schools. He's like hey, come in here and check this out. We were buddies, we were friends, this is just. He was like check this, Look what I have to write this big, long, huge three-page reports for money.
Speaker 5:Forfeitures. I was like you have to do that. He said, yeah, sit down and write one or type it, just copy and paste it. I was like I get through one of them. I was like I get through like one of them. I was like, no, no, I said why you do it? You know, I remember he's like I can't ask. I got these guys doing this. He can't type, so I don't know if he's testing me out to see if I'm going to be his scribe or not. I was like holy cow, it was tedious and horrible.
Speaker 3:I was like I don't know, and that's you know. I wouldn't take anything for the time that I spent in each of those areas, because it's a great learning experience.
Speaker 5:You got that opportunity to go through the rings. I went from lieutenant to interim so I knew how to order uniforms and buy cars. That was what I was, and I run a squad, you know. But that was my admin job was I took care of cars maintenance and I think that's a good.
Speaker 3:I think that being where the position that I was in at the time and I know this, you know it's kind of not the comical stuff that you normally guys do but being able to take a step of the way choke today, learn a little bit along the way, was great.
Speaker 2:but well, and it gives you. Once you get to that number one spot, you've got so much more experience, perspective and us.
Speaker 5:Yeah, and rather than I had a very charmed patrolman. You know patrolman to sergeant Very charmed I had. I was on the interdiction team with the state police. So I got to police in Bowling Green and you know just where the Hyda counties were, that was a rarity. I got to go. I was a training officer. That was a rarity, I got to go. I was a training officer. I was a canine handler, I was. You know, I got to do so many different things in that lower, you know, in the you know patrolman, the sergeant stuff. It was pretty cool, yeah, but one of the one of the crate you know decks like, so I put him for that detective spot.
Speaker 5:You were detective for a day. I know we've talked about it, but Derek scared the snot out of me. It's not because he didn't think I could do the job, but I was like the responsibility that came with it.
Speaker 5:All right, here, we got it, you got it. It wasn't no, like you, you know. I know he's proud, you know, because he knew I could do the job or he wouldn't have offered it. But he was like you know, if you screw this up, you're going to go. You know you can go to prison for this. Are you sure? You know? It's like yeah, let's see if Travis, if T-Dot, really wants to go that route. It was a smart move because I really was. You know, I was on the fence about it anyway. So the next day I was like hey, I want to go back to school.
Speaker 3:I want to go back to SRO. Travis had a couple of those spots where he would come in and be like Travis come in and go, what can I do for you? I'd be like I'll tell you what you can do for you. Yeah, Tell you what you can do for me, Traps. Okay, Then you come back later, Maybe. Maybe, it's not.
Speaker 5:It was the opposite of those. Tiktoks where they're like. I'm having a really good time. I'm not having a good time at the fair. Yeah, I'm having a really good time. No, that was the opposite. I really thought I would be like this would be a really good job for me. I think I can help you here. You know what I was really mistaken about? That I was wrong.
Speaker 2:I would like to go back, but it really taught.
Speaker 5:You learn how it's humbling when you learn your limitations and what you're good at and your strengths and weaknesses. Go with your strengths. Know your weaknesses, weaknesses and have good people around you that can do that, and that's that's very important in leadership, too, and it's it's part of it. Know thyself, but anyway, we want to conclude it here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're at.
Speaker 5:Uh, we've been yapping for an hour and 45 minutes yeah, you got the record, bro, you probably have to cut half this. No, this has been classic. It's behind the scenes, it's inside, look Nobody he didn't know you as anything but the chief man.
Speaker 3:I know you get a chance to be chief, don't?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I believe you want it Really. You think I'm ever going to?
Speaker 5:have a chance to be chief Are you kidding.
Speaker 3:Did you see the way my career started? Do you think I can do that?
Speaker 2:We won't rule it out, but I'm not on it.
Speaker 5:I should have been fired in the academy because of Danny Robinson.
Speaker 3:Chief Holland said I was lucky to be here.
Speaker 5:Oh my gosh, we had such a good time. I love it. Thank you for coming on We'll oh my gosh, we had such a good time. I love it, thank you for coming on.
Speaker 2:Thanks for the balls Absolutely enjoyed it.
Speaker 5:We'll do it again.
Speaker 3:I want to do a big cool live. I think that'd be hilarious to get all these people in here.
Speaker 2:We keep talking about bringing Hump in.
Speaker 5:I can tell you stories on Hump. We'll get a group.
Speaker 3:Let's do it Hump and Flump.
Speaker 2:Yep, all right, guys, thanks for listening. We'll hit you on another episode later. We'll see you later. Bye, bye, bye.
Speaker 1:Bye, I took the pre-sign.